SADHGURU ON PADMAAVAT, COWS AND MORE

Actress Kangana Ranaut, who has often expressed her fascination with spirituality and mysticism, recently engaged in a dialogue with the mystic Sadhguru. The conversation between the actress and the mystic was wide-ranging, where she interviewed him and put across her own opinions on issues like the Padmaavat controversy, protecting the cow vs cow vigilantism, the paradox of many Indians heading global conglomerates but India still lagging behind, and the ‘fanaticism of liberals’, among many other topics. Excerpts:

ON THE PADMAAVAT EPISODE

Sadhguru: That was not about religion. There are many political aspects to it. When this whole issue was happening, when they were burning buses, I called somebody who is a very responsible person in the country and asked, what is this and how are we allowing this to happen? If you don’t like a movie, then don’t go for it. Why do you have to burn a bus that people have to use tomorrow morning? I was told that some 100 women have dressed like brides and they are sitting ready to burn themselves, and volunteers are ready to burn themselves. Today, if we handle them roughly on the street, tomorrow if even ten of them burn themselves, it will become an international issue. Let the buses burn for one or two days and we will deal with it. I thought it was a strange kind of wisdom, but it is wisdom… An unfortunate way of getting attention is burning the bus. In every other country, when they want to protest, they burn old tyres. I think our people don’t know how to take the tyre out, so they burn the entire bus (laughs!).

ON COW VIGILANTES

Sadhguru: Cows would have always been saved in this pastoral country, because cattle were the wealth of this nation. If you look at the Mahabharata, they are not talking about land as wealth but cattle as wealth. How many heads of cattle one owned, determined how rich one was. So, if somebody stole a cow, they caught them and beat them up. This whole lynching debate — these people who are talking about it have not seen India. They are just living in cities and television studios and endlessly talking about it. Let me say this clearly, I have always been connected with rural life. In my life, I have witnessed three cases of lynching… If you steal their children, if you steal their cows and if you cut a tree, then they resort to lynching. I try to get into this and stop it. But I am told not to get into this and I am pushed aside. I knew the local sub-inspector who was a senior in my college and told him, you need to do something about this. He said, “You don’t get into this. This is how it is. They have their own law and I am a police officer and I enforce a certain aspect of the law. Rest of the law is handled by them on their own terms. Since, there isn’t complete law enforcement in the country, people manage their own things.”

I’m not trying to say, this is the way to do it. All I am trying to say is, when the mob is trying to enforce their idea of justice, this is how it gets enforced. If we want to change this, there are many things that we need to do. It’s not about saving cows. Whatever is precious to them, if they believe somebody is taking it, they can’t call the police. Law enforcement needs to come in at all levels of life. Law enforcement has not reached the entire geography of this nation. Let’s get to that.

Sadhguru: Today, people who claim to be liberals are actually fanatics

Sadhguru: Today, people who claim to be liberals are actually fanatics
Actress Kangana Ranaut made yet another debut by turning interlocutor, when she engaged in a dialogue with mystic Sadhguru. Her questions ranged from why Indians need the stamp from the west for ideas and people worthy of consideration to why Indians head some of the biggest multi-national conglomerates while the country is still lagging behind. She attempted to steer the conversation towards making spiritualism relevant to everyday life. The actress also discussed cow vigilante violence and the ‘Padmaavat’ controversy that led to her contemporary, Deepika Padukone being threatened with violence and buses being burned as a form of protest. Excerpts from ‘In Conversation with the Mystic’…
Kangana Ranaut: I am working on the biopic of a martyr. Lakshmibai, the protagonist goes and saves a calf. My crew had a huge discussion about it. We halted the shoot and said she can’t save a calf; it has to be a lamb, because we don’t want to look like cow savers. When such a prejudice strikes, you are protective as a person of what you are because of your values. You want to save all animals, why just a cow. Lynching takes place (because of a cow) and you jump to the other side, which has always been criticising and never wanting to protect cows. These people look sensible because they are the so called liberals. Liberals by definition, I have just recently learnt English, and I have to access the dictionary for everything. The dictionary meaning of liberals is people who have acceptance for people, opinion, thoughts…
Sadhguru (Cuts in): No no they are fanatics (audience laughter)
Kangana: These liberals will not take you in their group until you hate the same thing and same people as they do. But what I don’t get is what the agenda and the plan of action that the liberals have to bring this country out of the pit. When a war breaks out, liberals are the first one to say, in fact, people from my industry say, why should we be bothered with war, we are artistes. In the process, they are demotivating the man who is protecting the borders for you. A rape takes place in Kashmir and they say, Hindustan raped our daughter and point fingers at each other when the country is so vulnerable. They are trying to incite a civil war. Is that what liberals do? Then I think, wait a minute, the most sensible thing to do is to be a sceptic. But a sceptic is nothing but a space cadet who doesn’t know where he is going. So, right now we need a definite direction. We cannot be stuck in the unfortunate loop of ‘to be or not to be’. So, what should we do?
Sadhguru: They thought, people of the city you were talking about (London) that ‘to be or not to be’ was the most intelligent question. They rarely came to existential questions. Existential questions are a daily affair for us in this country. Those are the rudimentary ways in which they addressed it. I think it is the dumbest question to ask because you have not tasted life. When you are ecstatic, do you ask the question, ‘to be or not to be?’ In some way you are frustrated and burdened and that’s why you are asking ‘to be or not to be?’ Today, in the world, people who claim to be liberals are actually fanatics. If you don’t agree with them, they will finish you. Coming to the Rani of Jhansi saving the cow, she is a woman who stands out in our history…
Kangana (cuts in): But she did save a cow, but we should not show that it’s a cow.
Sadhguru: We don’t know who wrote the story and she didn’t save one cow. Cows would have always been saved in this pastoral country, because cattle were the wealth of this nation. If you look at the Mahabharata, they are not talking about land as wealth but cattle as wealth. The land was there in plenty. How many heads of cattle one owned, determined how rich one was. So, if somebody stole a cow, they caught them and beat them up. This whole lynching debate that’s going on in the country and these people who are talking about it, have not seen India. They are just living in cities and television studios and endlessly talking about it. Let me say this clearly, I have always been connected with rural life. In my life, I have witnessed three cases of lynching. In two cases, they were killed and in the third instance, nearly killed. In one case, they believed that this man could be stealing their children. If you steal their children, if you steal their cows and if you cut a tree, then they resort to lynching. I try to get into this and stop it. But I am told not to get into this and I am pushed aside. I knew the local sub-inspector who was a senior in my college and told him, you need to do something about this. He said, “You don’t get into this. This is how it is. They have their own law and I am a police officer and I enforce a certain aspect of the law. Rest of the law is handled by them on their own terms. Since, there isn’t complete law enforcement in the country, people manage their own things”.
Kangana: But there are lot of other atrocities…
Sadhguru: I am not trying to say, this is the way to do it. All I am trying to say is, when the mob is trying to enforce their idea of justice, this is how it gets enforced. Unfortunately, that’s where we are. If we want to change this, there are many things that we need to do. It’s not about saving cows. When people said, somebody is a child lifter, why didn’t you start a debate about that? You didn’t because you know that if you started a debate about ‘Don’t save your children’, then you will get it back. Cow is an easy thing right now to go at. So, this is not about cows. Whatever is precious to them, if they believe somebody is taking it, they can’t call the police. If they call the police, they will come after 24 hours, and when they come, there will be many other issues. It doesn’t get settled and people have their own way of settling it, and unfortunately, people are getting killed on the street. If you don’t want it go there, then law enforcement needs to come in at all levels of life. Law enforcement has not reached the entire geography of this nation. Let’s get to that. We need to do that.
Kangana: I am a Rajput myself and when the whole ‘Padmaavat’ episode took place and there was this talk of cutting off of one of my contemporary’s nose, I was embarrassed…

Sadhguru (cuts in): This wouldn’t disturb anybody if it were Hollywood because a lot of them have cut their nose and replaced it (laughs!).
Kangana: Criminals cannot be associated with religion.
Sadhguru: That was not about religion. There are many political aspects to it. When this whole issue was happening (and Prasoon (Joshi, CBFC Chairman is present here), when they were burning buses, I called somebody who is a very responsible person in the country and asked…what is this and how are we allowing this to happen? If you don’t like a movie, then don’t go for it. Why do you have to burn a bus that people have to use tomorrow morning? I was told that some 100 women have dressed like brides and they are sitting ready to burn themselves, and volunteers are ready to burn themselves. Today, if we handle them roughly on the street, tomorrow if even ten of them burn themselves, it will become an international issue. Let the buses burn for one or two days and we will deal with it. I thought it was a strange kind of wisdom, but it is wisdom. Instead of giving commentaries, because somebody went to a western university without understanding the reality, is not done. There are unfortunate realities of various kinds of divisions which people are trying to play up. When they don’t have a voice to say something, they will gather their community, group of people who speak a similar language or people from the same religion together, and do something on the street to get attention. An unfortunate way of getting attention is burning the bus. In every other country, when they want to protest they burn old tyres. I think our people don’t know how to take the tyre out, so they burn the entire bus (laughs!).

Sadhguru That was not about religion There are many political aspects to it When this whole issue was happening when they were burning buses I called somebody who is a very responsible person in the country and asked what is this and how are we allowing this to happen If you dont like a movie then dont go for it Why do you have to burn a bus that people have to use tomorrow morning I was told that some 100 women have dressed like brides and they are sitting ready to burn themselves and volunteers are ready to burn themselves Today if we handle them roughly on the street tomorrow if even ten of them bur
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